Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Report bugs & feature requests for MediaMonkey for Android and learn about the newest beta build.

Moderator: Gurus

toyzrme
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:31 pm
Location: Cary, NC
Contact:

Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by toyzrme » Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:04 pm

Hi -
I am rating my songs in MMA, syncing them back to MMW.
I sync a playlist for Unrated tracks (rating = unknown, or rating < .5), and a playlist for tracks >= 3.
So I'm expecting songs that I rate will disappear off of the "Unrated" playlist, and either disappear from my phone, or migrate to the 3+ playlist.

This was working fine for a while.

Then, I noticed I started hitting many tracks in my "Unrated" playlist that already have ratings - i.e. they show as 0 Stars in MMW, but 1-5 stars in MMA. I have confirmed this to make sure I'm looking at the right tracks.

There are other tracks that have *different* ratings - i.e. 5 on MMW, but 2 on MMA.

How could this happen? Is it safe to sync anything now?

I am very concerned, as this represents 2+ years of rating work - I would hate to see a version update (which happens automatically in Android) start changing ratings without knowing it.

This is on Galaxy S4, Android 4.4.4. Windows 7/64. WiFi syncing. MMA 1.1.0.405, MMW 4.0.5.1719.
Steps to re-create:
MMW:
- create a playlist, all 'rock' music with rating=Unknown (my lists originally had >2000, but this even happened when it was <500)
- create a playlist, all 'rock' music with rating, .5 stars (just for coverage)
- create a playlist, all 'rock' music with rating>=3 stars
- sync those playlists
- play/random the playlist(s), and rate the tracks (I had rated many before I noticed this happening) - note which tracks you rate
- sync the ratings from MMA->MMW, and playlists from MMW->MMA
Verify:
- see if the tracks disappeared from the 'Unknown' playlist to the 3+ playlist
- see if any tracks changed ratings

There was probably at least one MMA update in there - not sure if that could have caused it.

Thanks.
Environment:
MMW: ~25,000 tracks, MM.DB on 16Gbps PCIe SSD (Samsung 950 Pro) - up-to-date, not Beta
MMA: ~12,000 tracks sync'd to phone - up-to-date, not Beta
PC: Windows 10/64, Skylake quad+HT @4.2GHz, 32GB RAM, 14TB RAID6
Phone: Galaxy S7 (32GB) + 200GB mSD card (Samsung EVO+)
Sync: all tracks rated >=3 sync'd to phone
.........all playlists only use tracks rated >=3
.........thus sync'ing is 99.99% playlist update - no tracks are sync'd, other than new purchases
Playlists: ~59 synced
..........most are auto-playlists
..........use attributes Rating, Last Played, Date recorded, Genre, Genre "contains", Path "contains"
..........many are nested, i.e. "Top AutoPlaylist" includes "Level 2 AutoPL #1" + "Level 2 AutoPL #2" etc.

Lowlander
Posts: 46273
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 5:53 pm
Location: MediaMonkey 5

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by Lowlander » Fri Mar 06, 2015 3:30 pm

Update MMW to 4.1.6.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

rusty
Posts: 7221
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2003 3:39 am
Location: Montreal, Canada

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by rusty » Sun Mar 08, 2015 7:07 pm

btw, if you're syncing via USB, it's possible that you're experiencing a problem in which the clock of your device isn't in sync with the clock on your PC, causing syncs to occur in the wrong direction. You can see more about this at http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=12555

-Rusty

toyzrme
Posts: 101
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:31 pm
Location: Cary, NC
Contact:

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by toyzrme » Mon Mar 09, 2015 9:12 am

Thanks for the feedback.

FYI I am syncing over WiFi.
Also, I don't rate songs on MMW - only MMA, and only sync every few days. So I wouldn't think a small clock difference (i.e. < a few hours, although all my devices are within minutes of each other) could cause any problems - unless there was incorrect handling of timestamps, or some bad math going on with comparisons.

Are you suggesting that the ratings never got back to MMW? This would explain why they are still included in the Unrated playlist - but why would this only happen to SOME tracks? And how can I force them to go down to MMW? Wipe and re-rate?

There were database updates done on the phone (i.e., a MMA was updated, and when I started it, it said something about re-creating the database) - since the tracks were initially sync'd onto the phone, this has happened more than once. Could something have happened in there, e.g. some data lost in the update?

I have not sync'd again in a while, concerned that if "bad" ratings are somehow surfaced on the Android device, on tracks I do not see or touch, they will overlay the "good" ratings on my MMW library. I just happened to get lucky, and chanced to play a song on MMA that I *knew* I had rated a 5 (confirmed on MMW), yet it showed as a "2" (MMA). Is there a way to confirm that this wouldn't happen (i.e. that "2" get sync'd back to MMW) and trash my MMW library?

The fact that I song I rated as a 5 on MMA, got sync'd back to MMW in the past correctly, but then got pulled down/updated on MMA as a 2, concerns me. This particular song I would have NEVER rated less than 4 - so it's somewhere in the exchange that the rating got changed.

Would 4.1.6 make it safe to sync ratings back to MMW? Or do I need to wipe the device and start all over again, syncing and re-rating all the tracks?

Thanks.
Environment:
MMW: ~25,000 tracks, MM.DB on 16Gbps PCIe SSD (Samsung 950 Pro) - up-to-date, not Beta
MMA: ~12,000 tracks sync'd to phone - up-to-date, not Beta
PC: Windows 10/64, Skylake quad+HT @4.2GHz, 32GB RAM, 14TB RAID6
Phone: Galaxy S7 (32GB) + 200GB mSD card (Samsung EVO+)
Sync: all tracks rated >=3 sync'd to phone
.........all playlists only use tracks rated >=3
.........thus sync'ing is 99.99% playlist update - no tracks are sync'd, other than new purchases
Playlists: ~59 synced
..........most are auto-playlists
..........use attributes Rating, Last Played, Date recorded, Genre, Genre "contains", Path "contains"
..........many are nested, i.e. "Top AutoPlaylist" includes "Level 2 AutoPL #1" + "Level 2 AutoPL #2" etc.

rusty
Posts: 7221
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2003 3:39 am
Location: Montreal, Canada

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by rusty » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:30 pm

A couple of points to consider:
MMW 4.1.6 has numerous sync-related improvements (and a total of ~50 improvements) over MMW 4.1.5. You should update as soon as possible.
The issue of time-calculation doesn't affect Wi-Fi synchronization (the wi-fi sync protocol is able to sync time discrepancies, whereas the MTP protocol used for syncing over USB doesn't).

As to how this issue might have arisen, my guess would be that a change was made on both MMA and MMW, and the MMA change was more recent than the MMW change. Regardless, I'd suggest that it's a good idea to periodically back up your MMW database.

-Rusty

76firefly
Posts: 53
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:10 pm

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by 76firefly » Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:26 pm

I'm having a similar if not the same problem. Syncing between the two I have lost all my 4.5 ratings, all of the 4.5 got automatically rated down to a 4, which was like 5 years worth of rating. But it's ok, it gave me an opportunity to go through all my 4.0 ratings to reevaluate. But anyhow, I just got a Note 4, running both the latest beta MMA and current MMW as of today. I synched all my playlists which are all dynamic playlists based on stars to my phone and none of the ratings transferred along with the files to my phone. So when I play a song it shows no rating. I do rate them on my phone as I play but now I'm afraid to synch back to MMW because I'm wondering if it'll synch back all the ratings from my phone to MMW which never made it over to my phone in the initial synch. Basically I'm afraid that I'll lose all my ratings since it's a two way sync? Is there a setting I missed in the initial sync that it didn't transfer the ratings over to MMA? I need to sync because I want to add new files from MMW to MMA but I'm afraid to lose all my ratings again. Hope this makes sense!

Casey

ChoppedBroccoli
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2013 2:51 am

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by ChoppedBroccoli » Wed Jun 24, 2015 2:56 pm

76firefly wrote:I'm having a similar if not the same problem. Syncing between the two I have lost all my 4.5 ratings, all of the 4.5 got automatically rated down to a 4, which was like 5 years worth of rating. But it's ok, it gave me an opportunity to go through all my 4.0 ratings to reevaluate. But anyhow, I just got a Note 4, running both the latest beta MMA and current MMW as of today. I synched all my playlists which are all dynamic playlists based on stars to my phone and none of the ratings transferred along with the files to my phone. So when I play a song it shows no rating. I do rate them on my phone as I play but now I'm afraid to synch back to MMW because I'm wondering if it'll synch back all the ratings from my phone to MMW which never made it over to my phone in the initial synch. Basically I'm afraid that I'll lose all my ratings since it's a two way sync? Is there a setting I missed in the initial sync that it didn't transfer the ratings over to MMA? I need to sync because I want to add new files from MMW to MMA but I'm afraid to lose all my ratings again. Hope this makes sense!

Casey

Same problem here running Win10 Tech Preview, MMW 4.1.7.1741, MMA 1.1.2.0415 on Nexus 5 Lollipop 5.1.1

When I sync music over USB (manual sync OR auto sync playlsits) I end up with files with most of the meta data correct, but the ratings and lyrics are missing. They are certainly present on the windows side, so something during sync is wiping them out and not making it to the Android device.

ChoppedBroccoli
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2013 2:51 am

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by ChoppedBroccoli » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:20 pm

ChoppedBroccoli wrote:
76firefly wrote:I'm having a similar if not the same problem. Syncing between the two I have lost all my 4.5 ratings, all of the 4.5 got automatically rated down to a 4, which was like 5 years worth of rating. But it's ok, it gave me an opportunity to go through all my 4.0 ratings to reevaluate. But anyhow, I just got a Note 4, running both the latest beta MMA and current MMW as of today. I synched all my playlists which are all dynamic playlists based on stars to my phone and none of the ratings transferred along with the files to my phone. So when I play a song it shows no rating. I do rate them on my phone as I play but now I'm afraid to synch back to MMW because I'm wondering if it'll synch back all the ratings from my phone to MMW which never made it over to my phone in the initial synch. Basically I'm afraid that I'll lose all my ratings since it's a two way sync? Is there a setting I missed in the initial sync that it didn't transfer the ratings over to MMA? I need to sync because I want to add new files from MMW to MMA but I'm afraid to lose all my ratings again. Hope this makes sense!

Casey

Same problem here running Win10 Tech Preview, MMW 4.1.7.1741, MMA 1.1.2.0415 on Nexus 5 Lollipop 5.1.1

When I sync music over USB (manual sync OR auto sync playlsits) I end up with files with most of the meta data correct, but the ratings and lyrics are missing. They are certainly present on the windows side, so something during sync is wiping them out and not making it to the Android device.
Trying the current MMA Beta did not solve the issue either. This is a pretty annoying problem as all my music is starred and has embedded lyrics. It also poses some possible nasty issues if back sync is enabled and might trash ratings/lyrics on the MMW host (haven't run into that yet). Does this need a new bug report, or does the one posted earlier [http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=12555] apply? It seems like someone posted it was fixed in an earlier build in the bug report, but that clearly isn't the case.

ChoppedBroccoli
Posts: 13
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2013 2:51 am

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by ChoppedBroccoli » Thu Jun 25, 2015 7:53 pm

ChoppedBroccoli wrote:
ChoppedBroccoli wrote:
76firefly wrote:I'm having a similar if not the same problem. Syncing between the two I have lost all my 4.5 ratings, all of the 4.5 got automatically rated down to a 4, which was like 5 years worth of rating. But it's ok, it gave me an opportunity to go through all my 4.0 ratings to reevaluate. But anyhow, I just got a Note 4, running both the latest beta MMA and current MMW as of today. I synched all my playlists which are all dynamic playlists based on stars to my phone and none of the ratings transferred along with the files to my phone. So when I play a song it shows no rating. I do rate them on my phone as I play but now I'm afraid to synch back to MMW because I'm wondering if it'll synch back all the ratings from my phone to MMW which never made it over to my phone in the initial synch. Basically I'm afraid that I'll lose all my ratings since it's a two way sync? Is there a setting I missed in the initial sync that it didn't transfer the ratings over to MMA? I need to sync because I want to add new files from MMW to MMA but I'm afraid to lose all my ratings again. Hope this makes sense!

Casey

Same problem here running Win10 Tech Preview, MMW 4.1.7.1741, MMA 1.1.2.0415 on Nexus 5 Lollipop 5.1.1

When I sync music over USB (manual sync OR auto sync playlsits) I end up with files with most of the meta data correct, but the ratings and lyrics are missing. They are certainly present on the windows side, so something during sync is wiping them out and not making it to the Android device.
Trying the current MMA Beta did not solve the issue either. This is a pretty annoying problem as all my music is starred and has embedded lyrics. It also poses some possible nasty issues if back sync is enabled and might trash ratings/lyrics on the MMW host (haven't run into that yet). Does this need a new bug report, or does the one posted earlier [http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=12555] apply? It seems like someone posted it was fixed in an earlier build in the bug report, but that clearly isn't the case.

MMW seemed to be getting more and more unstable (memory access violations, freezing on syncs and scans), so I downloaded the installer again from the MM website and reinstalled. Seems to be working again - tracks now show lyrics and ratings again and sync/scans aren't error-ing out. For whatever reason, the skin changed to an old version also despite selecting 'override system skin'. Not sure what the problem was since I reinstalled the same version, but perhaps some combination of running MMW in Win10 Tech Preview 64bit caused issues.

To top it all off im running in VirtualBox on a Macbook Pro, so lots of hw/sw configuration interactions.

76firefly
Posts: 53
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:10 pm

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by 76firefly » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:01 am

Still having this issue. My playlist on MMW are autoplayists based on ratings, so when I sync for the first time from MMW to MMA to the mirco SD card, it seems like half the rating come through and the other half have no ratings. Now my sync list are playists that are set on MMW so there are rating on all these tracks originally, but when I sync the playlist the songs are there but half of the rating are missing? Not really sure where I'm going wrong here. :/

Lowlander
Posts: 46273
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 5:53 pm
Location: MediaMonkey 5

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by Lowlander » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:13 pm

Which versions of MMA and MMW and are you doing a wifi or USB (with card in phone) sync?
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

MusicKing
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:14 pm

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by MusicKing » Sun Apr 22, 2018 3:05 pm

Because MMW still freezes when syncronizing (on a micro-SD card) with MMA (Samsung A5), I unplug that memory card and put it in the computer manually to sync. When that is done, MMW shows me that the ratings should be present on that memory card.

When fitting the memory card back into the phone, the songs and playlists are there, but no ratings. What am I doing wrong? (Don't get me started about 'wifi sync', I've tried that a 1000 times and I can't get it to work.)

Lowlander
Posts: 46273
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 5:53 pm
Location: MediaMonkey 5

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by Lowlander » Sun Apr 22, 2018 3:22 pm

You're relying on Android Media Scanner when you sync to the SD card directly instead of the phone. If you sync to the phone with MMA the Ratings will be there.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

MusicKing
Posts: 37
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2017 3:14 pm

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by MusicKing » Sun Apr 22, 2018 4:10 pm

Lowlander wrote:You're relying on Android Media Scanner when you sync to the SD card directly instead of the phone. If you sync to the phone with MMA the Ratings will be there.
Then it freezes...... See:

http://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=12961

Lowlander
Posts: 46273
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 5:53 pm
Location: MediaMonkey 5

Re: Ratings not honored / different between MMW & MMA

Post by Lowlander » Sun Apr 22, 2018 4:15 pm

See: http://www.mediamonkey.com/support/inde ... tion-fails MMW to MMA is the only way to get more of the tags to come across. It can be either USB or wifi sync, depending on what works better for you.
Lowlander (MediaMonkey user since 2003)

Post Reply