why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

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astro46
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

will an option to turn off network polling be added to mm5?
rusty
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by rusty »

From what I see at https://www.ventismedia.com/mantis/view.php?id=17638 (item 3a), such network activity only occurs in current builds when the user interacts with a device/network node (in which case network activity would be expected). Additional improvements are planned for the future as described in the bug.

-Rusty
astro46
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

i haven't been interacting with any devices, other than the computer that mm5 is installed on and internet. I don't know what it would mean to say that I have been 'interacting with any devices'. Yet mm5 is continuously pinging several url's including the router control panel url.
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by Peke »

Hi,
What exact URL was that please what is teh router model/name. If you do not want to publish that in topic, please send me PM with router details and exact URL MM5 Tries to access and I'll try to reverse engineer the calls according to manual and firmware dump.

NOTE that these are very strong accusation on MM. Simply accessing https://xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx/ do not show/say anything about MM access.
Best regards,
Peke
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astro46
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

not a secret. I said what the url's are in the first post of this thread.
however, in the current version, i notice that mm5 is no longer trying (at least not today) for 224.0.0.251. it continues to try for 239.255.255.250. both are standard url's for media serving devices.

but it has added 192.168.1.1 which is a standard address for accessing router control panels. as is 192.168.0.1, which it continues to try for. these url's will bring up the login window for the router, if any routers on the local network are using those addresses. routers can use a number of addresses within that range.

in this case, simply opening mm5 starts the attempts. No action within mm5 has been taken. rejecting the attempts (not setting up a block rule) will mean mm5 attempts access again in about 20 sec. over and over. I don't know what the result would be if I allowed access. I haven't allowed it. I have encountered no other software that does this. And, of course, I don't know if it is from code that the mm team has written, or a subprogram that you are using from another source.
Peke
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by Peke »

Hi,
Quick Reply:
224.0.0.251 is multicast address do you have DLNA and sharing enabled? https://www.pcmag.com/encyclopedia/term/ip-multicast and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multicast_DNS that is accessed only on MM request eg if you ever played over DLNA to other deices MM announce itself that DLNA players/Renderers announce itself to MM
192.168.1.1/192.168.0.1: is common gateway address especially when using DHCP (Auto IP detection) and it is called any time MM wants to query Internet for some info. All data must go thru gateway. Check you Connection details and you will see

If you block MM from query Gateway/Local DNS then read this https://learningnetwork.cisco.com/s/que ... J/22400251 why it query 224.0.0.xxx it all comes around.

FYI as some users recently asked why MM5 do not use external frameworks for UI, well answer is a less worry about issues like yours. Questioning MM access and easier to track any potential issues (eg. reason why we are investigation your each report).
Best regards,
Peke
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astro46
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

Peke,

I don't have any devices on my local network that mm5 should need to connect with. There are no other media playing devices that it needs to communicate with, or obtain data from. But apparently mm5 will continue to poll network, just in case a network device comes on line 5 minutes from now, or an hour from now, or tonight. Why not turn it off?

as for mm5 needing information from internet, seems it should use a url, like every other program. 192.168.0.1 won't connect it to someplace on internet. only to a router control panel. perhaps you could supply a reference for your statement about this.

did you write the code for all this, or is the code imported (a subprogram) from somewhere else?
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by Peke »

astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pm I don't have any devices on my local network that mm5 should need to connect with. There are no other media playing devices that it needs to communicate with, or obtain data from. But apparently mm5 will continue to poll network, just in case a network device comes on line 5 minutes from now, or an hour from now, or tonight. Why not turn it off?
OK, why not deleting UPNP.DLL then?
astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pm as for mm5 needing information from internet, seems it should use a url, like every other program. 192.168.0.1 won't connect it to someplace on internet. only to a router control panel. perhaps you could supply a reference for your statement about this.
That is not true if 192.168.0.1 is your gateway and DNS for your internet then if you want to access https://www.mediamonkey.com/ then your PC needs to ask your router on 192.168.0.1 for right IP address of mediamonkey.com which is in fact http://www.mediamonkey.com/ -> http://54.39.221.200/ or you would get URL address unknown. Real life example would be to tell you navigation application on your phone(Router in this case) "Hey google" -> "Show me closest Walmart store in Longmont Colorado" -> "Closest is Supercenter #905 2285 East Ken Pratt Blvd, Longmont, CO 80504". Well you accessed microphone, recorded your voice, accessed voice recognition. But your phone is checking from time to time if you have said "Hey google", If you disable it then it was like you deleted UPnP.dll in MM.
astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pmdid you write the code for all this, or is the code imported (a subprogram) from somewhere else?
No we did not write that code for this Microsoft did according to published a paper entitled "A Protocol for Packet Network Intercommunication" that was in May 1974 written by the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers (IEEE) or its upgraded versions.
Best regards,
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astro46
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

Peke wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 8:10 pm
astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pm I don't have any devices on my local network that mm5 should need to connect with. There are no other media playing devices that it needs to communicate with, or obtain data from. But apparently mm5 will continue to poll network, just in case a network device comes on line 5 minutes from now, or an hour from now, or tonight. Why not turn it off?
OK, why not deleting UPNP.DLL then?

I have done that, and it works for stopping the repeated polling. It doesn't seem right to expect users to remember to delete a file/function that they don't use, every time program is updated. if it is optional use, makes more sense to be able to toggle it off/on in settings. which will carry over through updates.
astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pm as for mm5 needing information from internet, seems it should use a url, like every other program. 192.168.0.1 won't connect it to someplace on internet. only to a router control panel. perhaps you could supply a reference for your statement about this.
That is not true if 192.168.0.1 is your gateway and DNS for your internet then if you want to access https://www.mediamonkey.com/ then your PC needs to ask your router on 192.168.0.1 for right IP address of mediamonkey.com which is in fact http://www.mediamonkey.com/ -> http://54.39.221.200/ or you would get URL address unknown. Real life example would be to tell you navigation application on your phone(Router in this case) "Hey google" -> "Show me closest Walmart store in Longmont Colorado" -> "Closest is Supercenter #905 2285 East Ken Pratt Blvd, Longmont, CO 80504". Well you accessed microphone, recorded your voice, accessed voice recognition. But your phone is checking from time to time if you have said "Hey google", If you disable it then it was like you deleted UPnP.dll in MM.

that is a great example of the use and and need for polling. and why, since i have siri turned off on my iphone, i expect it isn't constantly scanning for instructions. Note that even apple gives option for turning off the scanning(siri).

as for 192.168.0.1, this doesn't naturally flow into a discussion of dns servers. I have not heard of a gateway (a combination modem/router in a local/home network) that can serve dns. there are a limited number of dns servers, and one of them is definitely not in My house. Gateways, or network settings on a local computer default to the internet service provider or can be set to direct dns calls to a particular dns server on internet like Opendns or Cloudflare. 192.168.0.1 is already an internet ready address and doesn't need a dns server. if the router sees 192.168.0.1, and that is the router's address, it stops there, knowing that this is a call to speak to the router (or gateway). anything else passes through to the internet to a destination or a dns server, to have the friendly name converted to an internet usable address. I'm sure that you already know all this, so don't understand why you refer to router address and dns at the same time.
astro46 wrote: Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:30 pmdid you write the code for all this, or is the code imported (a subprogram) from somewhere else?
No we did not write that code for this Microsoft did according to published a paper entitled "A Protocol for Packet Network Intercommunication" that was in May 1974 written by the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers (IEEE) or its upgraded versions.
would be good to know why microsoft thinks it advisable to keep trying to contact routers. If you can explain this, i would appreciate it. A response would be the router login screen? Then what? Again, i have not had any other software attempting to do this.

iac: would be nice to simply turn it off, rather than have a function continually cranking away in the background every 15 seconds that serves no purpose on my system. I may have the computer resources to deal with it. what about people that don't?
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by Peke »

astro46 wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:48 pm If you can explain this, i would appreciate it.
Unfortunately I do not know that answer.
astro46 wrote: Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:48 pm iac: would be nice to simply turn it off, rather than have a function continually cranking away in the background every 15 seconds that serves no purpose on my system. I may have the computer resources to deal with it. what about people that don't?
You are first and only one reporting this. Only way I can think of is that you enabled something on your router that MM thinks is Media Server and on access Router asks for login information.

Can you please open support ticket where we can get into more private details, without prying eyes. You really got me intrigued on the reason and would like nothing more than be 100% sure why it happens. I tried everything on My router(s), MikroTik, Switch (L2+), QNAP NAS, ... and not being able to replicate your behavior.
Best regards,
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Re: why is mm5 trying to access my router and multicast [#17638]

Post by astro46 »

done. Ticket #1123: "mm5 sending url for router"
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