big syncing, many crash, woe :(

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feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

Lowlander wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 5:09 pm Instructions on screenshots are provided, no personal webspace needed: https://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=97733

You can also open a Support Ticket which does allow you to directly attach screenshots.
I don't have an account on any of those ghastly image hosting services it suggests. It's not 2005 any more πŸ˜‰
Anyways it's cool.
feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

Anyways, we keep getting diverted off the point of this thread:

the real question I was asking was: if MMW5 gets into a mess about the sync state of a connected device,
is there a way to reset that? MMW5 must be storing/cacheing that state information somewhere.
In my case, every few months it keeps thinking that the 700GB of content on my 1TB SD card is no longer a synced copy of my music library, but instead a huge bunch 'other' files which it is not allowed to delete. Is there no way to clear this silly idea? there must surely be some kind of temp or cache or status file about it somewhere?
Lowlander
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Lowlander »

No account needed for imgbb.
Lowlander
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Lowlander »

If scanning hangs, please capture this in a debug log (step 4b) and attach the log to a Support Ticket: https://www.mediamonkey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=86643

This will help a developer analyze why this happens on your setup.
Peke
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Peke »

Hi,
feline1 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 5:19 pm there must surely be some kind of temp or cache or status file about it somewhere?
The only thing you can try is that from "%APPDATA%\MediaMonkey5\" you delete "persistent.*" files and start MM again.

FYI Scanning 700GB for consistency over USB (mostly using USB 2.0 connection speeds) can take up to few hours. It is simply physically limited by bottleneck of USB and SDcard speed.
Best regards,
Peke
MediaMonkey Team lead QA/Tech Support guru
Admin of Free MediaMonkey addon Site HappyMonkeying
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feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

OK thanks Peke, next time I get this I will definitely try that file in that directory
Last edited by feline1 on Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Barry4679
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Barry4679 »

feline1 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 12:18 pm Yet again, after a couple of months of behaving itself, I had an error message in MediaMonkey about a json lock file (? it left the screen before I could screenshot it), and now I am back in that state where I have a 1TB microSD card half full of music,
but MediaMonkey no longer recognises it as being a copy of my library (which is on my PC).
And it looks like the only workaround is gonna be to re-format the microSD card and spend several days trying to resync the entirely half a terabyte library all over again.

I'm strongly suspecting there's some kind of cache file that MediaMonkey is using to refer to my SDcard, that has gotten messed up. And if I could reset that, would return to happily resyncing my library again without me needing to wipe the card and start from scratch....? No?

I hesitate to contradict Peke, because knows more that I do, but ..

I am not sure that your problem is coming from the json file that he mentioned.
I have looked into that file a few times .. It is long long boring read, but I didn't notice anything in there that is controlling sync state at the target end.

The cache that you have been asking about should be at the target end.
I have never sync'd to s SD disk, but you should find it in the MediaMonkey directory on the card, or the device which is hosting your card..

example; when I sync to my android phone (no SD card), the cache is at \Internal shared storage\MediaMonkey\files in the mmstore.db file with most current date. But you shouldn't mess with that.

Instead, go here and familarise yourself with locations on your device|SD card that MM is able to delete things from

Then go here, and do a empty "sync" with the delete, and CONFIRMATION option set as shown.
That should show you which files MM5 has forgotten that it transferred.
Read the list carefully before allowing it delete anything.

The only thing that I know to do, is allow MM to delete them, and then try again. ... And hope this time you don't get a crash .. which is what probably caused this "forgetting".


But the other things to say is this
  1. you really are making a large job so much harder trying to do it at USB 2 speed .. USB3 is much better ... and WiFi is probably better too ... try it with a limited file set ... very long run times, at slow speed, just opens the door for issues to happen, IMO
  2. but the real problem is that you are trying to do an industrial sized job with a toy IMO
I have come to the opinion that MM sync is just a toy tool for little jobs .. like you I saw MM sync and had big plans ... I had a large empty phone, and a couple of tb of empty space at Dropbox ... so I tried MM5 to transcode and sync my large collection to .mp3 at these locations ... it is just not up to the job ... it easy to get started, but it all falls over in a heap when you try something big, or go back and try to refresh what you have done.

And when it does fall in a heap you have got a start-all-over-again mess to contend with.

And think about this thread. It took you 10 tries, and lots of patience, to get just one on-topic response, from the paid "support" guys, to your main issue.
And, from what I understand (guess?), that response is at least suspect.

I have this issue being tracked since February this year.
As you can see, it is not getting much love.
Also I spent a lot of frustrating hours trying to get it sorted in a Support Ticket.
There are so much higher priority issues there at the moment ... so I have abandoned MM Sync for the moment.
Want a dark skin for MM5? This is the one that works best for me .. elegant, compact & clear.
feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

Thanks for the suggestions, I will also look at those locations - although in the past, I have tried that (i.e. simply deleting the \Mediamonkey files on my SD card) but it didn't seem reset anything at MMW5's end.

Certainly if I had some spare cash to burn, I would upgrade my trusty USB2 Walkman to one with USB3 or WiFi syncing.

For what it's worth, using the latest MMW5 beta build and running it in safe mode (!) I seem to have gotten an order of magnitude less crapping out on my syncing - last night it ran for about 6 hours before throwing an error and my needing to run ScanDisk on the SD card, rather than about 1 hour. It's still going to take all weekend to resync, but that's better than all week.
Barry4679
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Barry4679 »

feline1 wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 6:31 am Thanks for the suggestions, I will also look at those locations - although in the past, I have tried that (i.e. simply deleting the \Mediamonkey files on my SD card) but it didn't seem reset anything at MMW5's end.
I am not suggesting that you use a tool external to MM to delete the unregistered files.
I am suggesting that you let MM5 do ... ie. see the 2nd image ... when you run the sync, MM5 then offers to delete those file ... I am suggesting that you allow MM5 to do this ... after reviewing the list.

Is good that you seem to have got more stability ... I haven't tested the most recent version yet.
Want a dark skin for MM5? This is the one that works best for me .. elegant, compact & clear.
feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

Oh hell.

Well, I got about three quarters of my 700GB re-synced, before one of the crashes put it back into that state where MediaMonkey was showing the SD card already full of 500GB of 'other' files (which in reality are just the three quarters of the files it had already synced) and thus no room to sync my library.

So, I tried Peke's suggestion of
> The only thing you can try is that from "%APPDATA%\MediaMonkey5\" you delete "persistent.*" files and start MM again.

... This has resulted in a situation where MM launches but all it shows is a tray icon. I can play music from my library with it, but I cannot get it to display the damn GUI!
I tried re-installing the MM but that didn't fix it.

Any suggestions?
Last edited by feline1 on Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
Rob_S
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Rob_S »

Is there some reason you can't just copy over your files using file explorer?

Then scan them with whatever player is on the device?
Using 5.1 LATEST alpha or beta build on Windows 10, HP laptop, managing 13k tracks
feline1
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by feline1 »

Rob_S wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 8:29 pm Is there some reason you can't just copy over your files using file explorer?
Is this really a serious question to ask on a forum for music librarian software? :lol:

I have a music library on my desktop PC (mirrored to Microsoft OneDrive) with about 35,000 items that is over 730 GB in size, probably over 80% ripped manually from hundreds of CDs that I've been buying since, er, 1987.
I use the music library software (MediaMonkey - you may have heard of it? :D ) to organise the tracks and tag them with metadata and artwork,
and then any time I do that, I can click a single button to 'sync' them, and it will replicate any changes onto my portable music player (a Sony Walkman) without me having to do any further manual intervention.

But yes, I could just manually copy the files using Windows file explorer, you're not wrong :lol:
I could probably manually rip CDs using a different program too. And do all the metadata by right-clicking in File Exporer :lol:
But I find it more efficient to use a music librarian program. I hope that answers your question :)
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Peke »

To both, Barry and Feline. You made me do a big small test. Although it is not 1TB SDCard, but my PC Synced around 100k of MP3s/FLACs/... (Some converted from various formats) onto external 1TB SSD set as sync device totaling 982GB.

Not a Single issue, except maybe it took almost 17h to finish :(

I am suspecting something different is in order. Please open support ticket so that we can into more private details, without prying eyes?
Best regards,
Peke
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Admin of Free MediaMonkey addon Site HappyMonkeying
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Rob_S
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Rob_S »

My suggestion was only to possibly avoid you further beating your head against the wall, as the amazing music library software did not appear to be working for you at this time!

Not to say that it shouldn't but it tries to do so many things like analyze volume levels, and convert unsuitable formats, and etc depending on your settings, some times back to basics can get the job done, if that is the goal.

If you just want a complete file for file and folder for folder sync, fast and hassle free, and can temporarily do without any of the library or conversion options, there is no better tool than "Total Commander", which will tell you in very short order if any files have been updated, added, or deleted on either side, and sync them one way or both ways.
Using 5.1 LATEST alpha or beta build on Windows 10, HP laptop, managing 13k tracks
Barry4679
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Re: big syncing, many crash, woe :(

Post by Barry4679 »

Peke wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 7:26 pm To both, Barry and Feline. You made me do a big small test. Although it is not 1TB SDCard, but my PC Synced around 100k of MP3s/FLACs/... (Some converted from various formats) onto external 1TB SSD set as sync device totaling 982GB.

Not a Single issue, except maybe it took almost 17h to finish :(
Interesting ... thanks.
was connection to your PC wired or via WiFi?

Could you try a smaller "big small test" ?
Start the sync .. let it run for a while, then break the connection

It probably has to be tested two ways:
  1. power off the target device during the sync
  2. and then in another test, terminate MM5 using Windows task manager while sync is in progress
ie. simulate a glitch due to comms interruption or error, or PC power saver kicking in, or MM5 getting its knickers in a twist for whatever reason, or whatever else happens

Then after each of these tests, reconcile what MM5 thinks has been transferred, which what is now on the target device.
Try to restart the process without having to do a bug chunk of the 17 hours all over again ... and|or, in the case of a sync to an Internet location having to re-transmit a lot of the data across the Internet again.

What is a deal breaker with MM5 sync is that it is not robust enough to handle a situation when something goes wrong during the sync.

This is no big problem if you are syncing small collections of tracks ... small amounts of crap heaping up on the target device are a problem which can be ignored ... or it is relatively easy to clear everything away, and then start again.

But if you are trying to sync large volumes of data, this situation is a deal breaker.
MM5 seems lacking the smart to be able to housekeep itself, and restart the remainder of the sync from where it left off.

IMO this makes MM5 sync useless for large tasks.


Peke wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 7:26 pm I am suspecting something different is in order. Please open support ticket so that we can into more private details, without prying eyes?
No .. I have given up on MM5 sync.

I spent two weeks trying to reconcile what was happening, and working via a Support Ticket.
The only outcome was frustration.
There are too many bugs, and it is all happening in a black box, with next to no visibility.
There is no usable way to reconcile or reset MM5 view of what has been completed|in-progress, to what the actual situation is.
Additional thoughts here.
Want a dark skin for MM5? This is the one that works best for me .. elegant, compact & clear.
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