Next MediaMonkey release status?

thefaceman · Post by **thefaceman** » Tue Jul 03, 2007 9:00 pm

Would it be possible for someone to post a status of the following?
Any information would be appreciated. Yes we understand the will be estimates. But a month, six months, 2 years?

1. Estimated time frame when 3.0 will be released?
2. Estimated time frame when 3.0 Beta will be released?
3. When the next patch for current version will be released? (if there is one in progress)

-thanks
-thefaceman

Post by **Lowlander** » Tue Jul 03, 2007 9:44 pm

Generally the developers don't give time frames. I guess to not disappoint as dates in software development normally are passed.

DazB · Post by **DazB** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 2:33 am

Hi,

Unless the application is really finished and being held back it is impossible for developers to give release dates, because;

Testing reveals bugs (the whole idea) and they need fixing.
Fixing one bug can lead to the creation of others. See 1.
If someone either comes up with a really good idea or notices a major oversight, it has to be coded. See 1.

They call it a testing cycle for a good reason, you can go round and round ad nauseam.

Daz

thefaceman · Post by **thefaceman** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:59 pm

Lowlander wrote:Generally the developers don't give time frames. I guess to not disappoint as dates in software development normally are passed.

Yes I agree, that just means that they are not good at estimating the workload and how long it will take them. But every software company has some idea of when they would like to release based upon the current list of issues they are planning on fixing. Then if a new issue appears they revise the release date. Having a release date at least give a sense of hope to the users that it will be sooner than later. So do you think it will be two years?
Really you can set the time frame for two years and then if you release early it will be nice.

-thanks

GSV3MiaC · Post by **GSV3MiaC** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 3:40 pm

If you want a completely meaningless date then '5 months'. On in marketing speak 'it'll be released for Xmas'.

Remember the first and second rules of engineering .. and software engineering is no different.

1) it takes longer
2) it costs more

(Some folks claim those are the same rule).

You can only estimate times for the things you know about. All surprises are extras. And 3.0 is going to be a semi-broken release, because the first release always is. If you want 'semi broken' you can have alpha-5 right now.

Most software companies revise releases in X month jumps, because they don't want to expend the cost/effort of re-estimating, and publishing the new answer, daily. That's how games go from 'Xmas' to 'Easter' to 'Thanksgiving' back to 'Xmas'.

thefaceman · Post by **thefaceman** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 6:23 pm

Five months is fine... even if that is for the "beta" release. Any consumer will tell you knowing a release date is better than knowing nothing. And if and when the release date is expected not to be met, then just make an announcement that an unexpected issue has post-poned the release. I fully understand that release dates are never met. In the world of software there are techniques that allow release dates to be determined.

I'd be curious, what are the issue that are NOT fixed that are still being fixed that are planned to be fixed. I see the list of issues that are fixed (which is quite extensive and APPRECIATED).

Trust me I think everybody would rather you take your time (even if it means it will take TWO YEARS) and get it right (we do not want a Vista release), all I was asking was what you estimate a release of Beta and Full release to be.

Please excuse me if I am crossing a line of being pushy, I do not mean to, I am just hoping to get some insight as to the progress of the next release. Hopefully I am not the only one.

-thanks
-thefaceman

trixmoto · Post by **trixmoto** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:42 am

Just to give you the flip side, I work for a software company who releases the next version every 6 months, on the dot. This means that customers keep needing to upgrade (for free) but it also means that the software is never really ready when we release it. We also have to release hotfixes every 3 weeks to fix everything that we didn't fix before the release!!

My point is, give them time to work their magic!!

Morten · Post by **Morten** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 5:21 am

What is the software company called Richard?

rovingcowboy · Post by **rovingcowboy** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:59 am

guy's / gal's do searches before you ask when it will be released.

this has been hashed out in about 4 other threads now.

i know most of you aint been around the forum that long but
you can see this simple way to tell is that;

you see rusty or jiri or peke in the forum more then once in 2 weeks you know they are getting near the release of the version. but until then they mostly lock up in the coding room and only scan once a week for new bug reports.

Juvenilemike · Post by **Juvenilemike** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:27 pm

As a software eng myself, I think you're being a little harsh on release dates. They're there to help coders too. They allow people to draw a line, to say that "'we'll have this feature, and this one, but not this one, because we wouldn't be able to integrate it in time for the release." They also help to encourage component-wise developement whereby one component or element is developed, tested, then integrated (and tested again), before another component is started.

And yes, I know that's a clinical description and real work has a lot more back and forth, but not so much that flexible delivery dates can't be made.

Mike
p.s. note that this isn't a criticsm of MM at all. I'm just speaking in general terms about release dates.

GSV3MiaC · Post by **GSV3MiaC** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:35 pm

There's a big difference between forecasting the next release, and making 6 monthly releases, where the what you're getting is 'creeping functionality and bug fixes' (not that M$ didn't manage to miss WinXP SP2 by several years anyway), and releases like MM3, where pretty much everything is changing .. well, everything around the database anyway, plus all the encoders/decoders, plus the need to support Vista (which continues to surprise even M$ with some of its quirks).

There are regular alpha releases coming out. Eventually there'll be one or more beta's. At some point someone will put their dangly-bits on the line and call it 'release 3.0'. Some point after that there will be a version that works pretty nearly perfectly for most people most of the time (but it will have a 'known bugs list' forever). I'm not sure what more people can reasonably expect to get.

Sebastian78 · Post by **Sebastian78** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 5:19 am

If you are getting criticized, it means you have done something RIGHT in the past and that people are expecting more from you now then before.

As the MM Team develops their software even further/better, people will start to expect better service from support, better information etc.

This results in the MM team being able to put higher prices on their services/software then before. This is evolution and usually how things work.

We should be given a date, because people are starting to get a bit "disappointed" with slow(er) progress. Some people here are also a bit hesitant/afraid to be seen as to criticize the team. But demanding a date and commenting on lack of information is not criticizing. When you pay for something, you can make demands to some extent. MM is not a "handout".

We are all friends, but friends can criticize each other when things are not as they should.

trixmoto · Post by **trixmoto** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:15 am

It's been said alpha 6 should appear this week, if things go to plan.

tbessie · Post by **tbessie** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 1:18 pm

I have some of Iambic's Palm apps, and they're ALWAYS releasing things late, doing major releases (so they can charge for them) instead of minor releases, adding new features while NOT fixing long-standing known bugs, and folks are always complaining on their forums about this.

Their product is really good -- well, WOULD be really good, if it weren't for all the bugs they don't seem to get around fixing. I would use something else, if they didn't provide such a feature-rich application that nobody else does quite right.

Compared to their buggy releases and a sense of distance from their developers, the Media Monkey team are Angels.

- Tim

durden999uk · Post by **durden999uk** » Thu Jul 12, 2007 2:00 pm

I think trix works for ubuntu - they have a six month release cycle.

Just a guess.

Next MediaMonkey release status?

Next MediaMonkey release status?

Five months

Umm

Take a look at "Iambic" and their product cycle...